Spurs & Arse*@l

[Simon]

It's a bit long winded, but have a read, pinched it off another site.

THOUGHT IT WAS A GOOD HONEST ASSESMENT.

David P gives us his insight on how Tottenham Hotspur and
Arsenal are two very different football clubs.

In Fever Pitch, Nicky Hornby tells the story of his relationship with
Arsenal. Of how the club, in all its merciless reliability, came to fill
the emotional space left by his absent father. Omnipresent and
consistent, it became the solid, dependable force needed by a
young male growing up. Well, if Arsenal is the benign parent,
reading you bedtime stories and scooping you onto his
shoulders, Tottenham is the dad who got drunk all the time,
screwed the au pair, and never turned up to sports day.

He said he would, he promised; swore, even. (You told all your
friends he was coming). But there you stood, outside the pavilion
, ballooning shorts and oversized T-shirt, with your plimsolls
tucked under your arm, looking up and down the street for the
unfeasibly expensive rental car that never came. Arsenal is the
father you never had; Tottenham is the father that never was.
But you love him anyway.

The Carling Cup semi final got me thinking; on Tottenham, on
Arsenal; on the differences between the two. When I first started
watching Spurs, and fell in love, the clubs were more or less
evenly matched. Yes, they had won a couple of leagues -
grindingly and joylessly - hoofing balls through the atmosphere
onto Alan Smith's nose. But still, this was a time when Dennis
Bergkamp, Dennis Bergkamp, a boyhood Spurs fan, wanted to
come to Us over Them. We turned him down of course - too
expensive. I think we bought Ruel Fox that year. But, that we,
Europeless and trophyless, could even be considered by a player
of his calibre...well, different times.

But then something happened. Bruce Rioch left (no two or three
season's 'transition period' grace for him), and was replaced, not
with Francis or Ardiles, or Hoddle or Pleat, or Hughton or Santini,
but with Arsene Wenger; and Arsenal began, this time with style,
to win.

And kept on winning. All Spurs fans, regardless of their feelings,
must give thanks to Manchester's hoary old king, frothing madly
on his American throne. It could have been much, much worse.
So Arsenal will go on; ecstatically organized, preposterously well-
disciplined; swaddled in top coaching, consistent management.
Years of behind-the-scenes efficiency built them. Decades of
discreet negotiations; firm, dry handshakes; gruff, soldierly nods.
Prudent alliances, kept promises, fulfilled potential, unbending
belief and cold-blooded focus...always focus. Somewhere in the
Emirates no doubt sit squadrons of accountants - I see them
now, row upon monotonous row - whirring contentedly, while
scouting networks intersect the globe - the new colonialists,
unearthing gold in Africa, importing diamonds from South America.

And Wenger smiles at us, year after year, addressing the camera
with restful Gallic urbanity. And I watch and feel, along with envy
and hate, guilt and shame.

Less than a mile east, as the crow flies. White Hart Lane.

Tottenham Hotspur. A ground of...well, emotion. Home to the
basic instincts: love, hate, betrayal, revenge; a gallery of
martyrs and villains, heroes and jesters. Homicidal boardrooms,
fratricidal changing rooms; suicidal supporters. Ill-advised
signings and public squabbles, Christian Gross.

Our team: lopsided. Up front, the sublime Berbatov, the sheer
spectacle of his play: languid, at times fussy, but always
beautiful. Scan down the field, and watch Young-Pyo Lee get
bullied by the corner flag. In true London wideboy style, we are
the league's own cut-and-shut - a McLaren front and a Metro
back, welded together by perennially optimistic management.

Tottenham v Arsenal is many things: not least a London Derby.

But, more than this, it is hope versus reality. And football is about
hope. It offers that most precious of things - the chance, each
year, to remake ourselves anew. At the beginning of the season
anything is possible, as we start, all equal in the eyes, if not of
God, the Premier League. And it is a bitter hope, one that is
rooted in life. I have a theory that young children should be made
to support Spurs, to teach them early on that life is a long series
of disappointments, but amidst all of this to Never Give Up.

Even when we were bad, and we have been very, very bad,
there was always ...something. Sometimes it wasn't quite
explainable, but it was there. Sometimes it was obvious, like a
Greaves or a Lineker, or a Klinsmann or a Sheringham, or a Ginola
or a Berbatov. That's why we have such good support, and why
we keep coming back. That, and hope. And glory. Much is made of
this at Tottenham, and it's all true. We have a relationship with
glory that Arsenal never will. Even their recent triumphs have an
almost perfunctory feel to them. Slick? Certainly, watchable?

Absolutely. But glorious? Never. The corporate bells and whistles
of Premier League success cannot hide the underbelly of banal
industriousness on which the club was built. It is the display of
the first class flight: the seat reclines artfully, the champagne
fizzes, the in-flight movie's a cracker. Studied luxury and
elegance, all mere gilding on the beating mechanistic heart.
It says a lot that for all their domestic success, Arsenal have
never been much good in Europe, the ultimate stage of those
glory nights. I think they won a couple of cups. What, when and
where? Who knows. Arsenal's most memorable European
contributions are, of course, losses. Beaten by a sublime chip that
is still talked about and replayed and discussed, and not only by
Spurs fans. Man United, one night in Spain, one nil down - two
goals in the final minutes: mathematically, that's a win, but more
than that, it's glory. Tottenham - the first English club to win a
European trophy, the winners of the first UEFA cup. Landmarks all
of them. Arsenal's greatest European story: a startled
appearance in a Champions League final, ending in defeat,
petulance and complaint. There is no glory with them in success,
or, just as importantly, in defeat.

And this is what it is about. As a footballer, the spectre of Gazza
loomed over his generation, far more than his achievements,
which, in actuality, were few. Gazza, far more than he was ever
Newcastle or Lazio or Rangers, was Spurs, the living embodiment
of the club: bulging with potential, occasional and (less often)
sustained brilliance, but brittle, flawed and ultimately a cautionary
tale of obliterated talent and self-destruction. Along the way,
though, the glory: he cried in Italy, that goal against Scotland,
that goal in the semi final, there was an epic quality to it all. Who
would you rather be? Marlon Brando, talent that ran to a
grotesque seed, a corpulent shadow of past glories, but
immortal; or Tom Hanks, cheerfully knocking out tactically astute,
successful product each year with the same dull clunk? Go
through the greatest England players of all time, there'll be a
few Spurs ones. Ask a Gooner to name some national Arsenal
greats; as soon as he says 'Tony Adams', which he will, he's lost.
The history of Tottenham is the history of a club that has had
some pretty good teams in its day; but more than this, it is the
history of individuals who transcend the egalitarian tyranny and
squalid anonymity of The Team.

I was at the Emirates for the first leg. It's a beautiful stadium.
Modern, efficient (I'm sure it's launched a thousand business
deals), but utterly soulless. And that is Arsenal: all style, even
more substance, but no soul. Tottenham are by turns sublime,
awful, exciting, dull, forward-looking, regressive, cohesive,
disorganised, good and bad, but above all, we have soul. And
thank God for that.

[Old Yid]

This may sound ridiculous but i feel sorry for them supporting their team (but not that sorry!)

They may have much more success over the last 20-30 yrs than us & yet they still want to get one over on us come what may. If they were really that superior to us, why are we the be all & end all of their season?. Why would they hate us in the way they do. We have a rivalry with Wet Spam but we don't actually hate them (really) because we know that in reality we are superior to them in every department.

Thats why the Scum hate us, because despite all their success, they are still glory hunting South London interlopers who bribed their way into the old div 1 & who are massive fair weather supporters. They will never have the true support that Tottenham have & will never really love their club they way we love ours. All they care about is success & not how it is achieved (hence the tiny smattering of English players).

They will tell you they are North Londoners but if a 27yr old Scotsman (or whoever) leave Glasgow for the first time & moves to England - if someone asks him 40 yrs later where he is from - you know what he will say!

I hate everything about them & everything that they stand for. I could go on....& on....& on....

[yidno1]

A slightly tedious read that one but some good lines in it never the less, I do hate West Ham though with a passion but obviously not as much as the arsenal.

The bit about their "fantastic stadium" is very apt i thought, it does indeed lack any passion that the Lane boasts so well, i beleive were making good strides to close the gap on and off the field with them but its a long road.

We all know as already stated there just a South london team in our territory so i guess their rivals are really Palace lol

[grimsby yidds]

cant be bothered with them, the bought there way into the top flight back in the old days, they never earned the right to be there , i dont even speak to there fans, they no nothing about there club, or there history, get back to plumtree where the belong, end of,

[berbaking]

my wee lad was getting slagged in school for supporting tottenham by wee lads who all support chelsea and manure and a*****l.
he came home and told me and i asked him how he felt about it.
he said "i don't care because they'll never understand why i support tottenham so there's no point talking to them - they're just jealous" he's 5!

[Simon]

my wee lad was getting slagged in school for supporting tottenham by wee lads who all support chelsea and manure and a*****l.
he came home and told me and i asked him how he felt about it.
he said "i don't care because they'll never understand why i support tottenham so there's no point talking to them - they're just jealous" he's 5!

Fair play to your boy, i have 2 junior Spurs aged 6 & 8 (both boys) and they get the same at school as well,
because up here everyone supports United, Liverpool, Newcastle etc, needless to say, we didn't have the
best start to the season and the boys came in for some stick from their brain washed, glory hunting little
mates and they just gave back as good as they got, and no matter how we are doing, they are always
willing to wear their shirts with pride.

[Old Yid]

I just want to give a big thumbs up to Simon's & Berbaking's lads!

You are rightly proud of them!